Modern XMPP project discussion - 2025-07-03

Hi, I also have a question about "Avatar" and "Profile picture". Does "Profile picture" here refer only to the user and not the group chat or channel? https://docs.modernxmpp.org/terminology/

Great question. I always struggle with what to call those. I think some research is needed.

Just call avatar an avatar

Group icon?

Two terms instead of a _commonly used_ single term. Nice (actually isn't)

Digital account picture icon

/s

Digital personal information record's owner pictographic description handle

alexkurisu: that you think it is called an avatar identifies you as being of a certain age/demographic. A bit of research will show you that this term is not typically used by mainstream platforms today, and therefore unfamiliar to many people.

"Avatar" is certainly still in use, definitely the more common term in e.g. gaming communities and such

I haven't checked discord, but I wouldn't be surprised if that called it an "avatar"

We're talking about the blue people right?

> I haven't checked discord, but I wouldn't be surprised if that called it an "avatar" with a quick look it seems so https://discord-avatar-maker.app/ ↺

and official docs https://support.discord.com/hc/en-us/articles/13410113109911-Avatar-Decorations

Makes sense

"Personal icon" and "group icon" might work to avoid "avatar" all together?

For me "avatar" is clearly person specific, so for groups it is a bit strange to use that term.

maybe we should narrow who are we defining it *for*. if it is for Discord EU/US people coming to XMPP it should be avatar. for people coming from irc, japan or other places it should be different. so defining first *who* we are defining it for helps imo

I agree

I have considered that we probably ought to split up ModernXMPP into different "profiles", but I don't have time for that right now

Ultimately, I'd note that it's all just guidelines, and if you're building something and you have a good reason to ignore something in the guidelines, that's fine

It's designed more to help people who don't have good reasons, but need some input and guidance

I don't think it's possible to make a one-size-fits-all magic UI/UX guide, each project will still need to adapt things to their platform, audience, etc.

But having some consistency at the core will hopefully help to minimize *unnecessary* inconsistencies between apps, and we have had far too many of those historically

Observation, this wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avatar_(computing)

So we should switch to "picons" and (for groups) "gicons"

percon and groucon 😀

in French "picon" is the name of an alcohol and "groucon" sounds very close to "gros con", the basic insult

I realize that "avatar" has the advantage that it's a pretty inter-language word already

Hey good morning everyone lol I feel kinda not smart I can’t figure out how to set up a jabber and I really need it for support

> "Personal icon" and "group icon" might work to avoid "avatar" all together? Avatars are not considered icons by anybody

Even "Face" and "Group image" would be better ("Avatar" is still better than both of them though)

Welcome Kleomenes. If you're texting here it means you have a Jabber account aready? Could you explain what exactly you're trying to set up?

They could be using https://chat.modernxmpp.org/

Oh right, I forgot about that

Kleomenes, is that the case? And what support is it that you need it for?

> Even "Face" and "Group image" would be better ("Avatar" is still better than both of them though) Agreed. To me an avatar is a representation of the thing (much like Hatsune Miku is a representation of a voice, given life by people) and not just an image ↺

"Profile Picture" for a MUC avatar does work if you think of the MUC as having a profile as well, but that would probably not make a lot of sense to newcomers. "Group Image" would be a better option I think

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