Modern XMPP project discussion - 2025-02-20

I guess you may have read some very old articles. I recommend you to use Gajim.

> Also Hats are good for that, waiting for the support in ejabberd :) Fwiw I'm still suspicious what we're gonna fit in hats. I hear all kind of things. It's probably gonna be a nightmare UX-wise ↺

I agree completely, which is partly why I did what I did to the XEP and made a simple implementation

To me "hats" should be a protocol for showing badges/etc. in the UI

Some people want (much) more than that, which is something that happens to unimplemented protocols

For example, hats as access control. I think it makes sense at some level, but you probably want your access control groups to be a separate layer, and hats are just for the UI part

Interesting

What would such separate layer look like?

Most likely one that also groups channels into collections, aka "spaces" (but that is a terrible term).

Technically it can be a pubsub node 🤷

> Most likely one that also groups channels into collections, aka "spaces" (but that is a terrible term). Does that even exist? ↺

I only know of Gajim's workspaces

But idk if any other implementation

Or let alone protocol that assists in such thing

> Technically it can be a pubsub node 🤷 Elaborate. I can't imagine what that would be like. ↺

Some ideas exist, but nothing more concrete afaik

A pubsub node is basically just a data storage you can subscribe to. You can store the channels and ACL in there for clients and servers to read.

Hmmm

> Most likely one that also groups channels into collections, aka "spaces" Yeah I don't know if ACLs should also go with spaces. That can still be a separate thing. Again, putting everything into everything, not a good idea IMO :/

We can think about how they may interoperate but we don't have to make them the same thing

I think both is channel metadata and can be treated as such

I think I'd rather think of the global thing at the space level. I still want to be able to use extended affiliations at the channel level without a space, probably

Maybe something that overrides local behaviour when using spaces. I don't know how exactly

This is all theoretical right? Is there any indication of a draft on how 'spaces' or 'extended affiliations' may work as a protocol?

Yeah it's theoretical. There isn't much about spaces in form of near-implementation or spec. The closest is gajim but that's more of a local-only UI thing than something that brings together channels and ways to advertise / administer them

Actually Kev has been doing some work on it recently, I had some lengthy discussion with him about how it could fit with GC3