Modern XMPP project discussion - 2025-03-21

Kaidan also is the only client currently that tries to make omemo actually usable afaik. with ATM among others

for everywhere else omemo exists but can't be used for 99% of use cases

Trust-on-first-use works fine here 🤷

But Kaidan could be indeed a nice client if they ever implement MUC or GC3

Squeaky Latex Folf, I had a blind friend who used to use Gajim without much complain, do you have specific feedback that would be actionable?

This was years ago though.

Same if you have specific issues with xmpp-rs, we’re listening to feedback.

> Squeaky Latex Folf, I had a blind friend who used to use Gajim without much complain, do you have specific feedback that would be actionable? I really wonder how they did it ↺

Back in 2020, I tried Gajim on Windows. It did not work at all with screen readers. But, that's not so surprising as GTK3 does not support Windows accessibility APIs

On Linux, though, Gajim gives some info to screen readers, but the application is basically impossible to traverse and navigate through

Since Gajim still hijacks tab too much for my liking, I have to use F6, but for some reason, Gajim hangs for a minute when using F6 to get to the roster

GTK 4 now uses AccessKit which supports all three of Linux, macOS and Windows, and soon will also support Android.

But she was on Linux.

Android accessibility is pretty messed up

> GTK 4 now uses AccessKit which supports all three of Linux, macOS and Windows, and soon will also support Android. is that merged? last i heard there was something in development but wasn't merged yet ↺

Squeaky Latex Folf, the hang is worth reporting.

The only open source screen reader is TalkBack, and basically all my blind friends agree that it sucks

it was also gonna be a protocol for wayland i think

There is a screen reader for Android called Jieshuo that is better than TalkBack, but it is proprietary

So Android accessibility is basically proprietary

One of my blind friends recently switched back to iOS and says it's much better than Android accessibility as a whole

accessibility is very rarely a concern foss/oss projects have from what I read. so that makes sense

MSavoritias (fae,ve), AFAIK no, Wayland isn’t involved in accessibility whatsoever, just in passing buffers and input.

hmm

MSavoritias (fae,ve), I see it in gtk/a11y/ in GTK’s repository, so I assume it got merged.

> MSavoritias (fae,ve), AFAIK no, Wayland isn’t involved in accessibility whatsoever, just in passing buffers and input. Currently, accessibility on Linux is handled by AT-SPI, a protocol on top of DBus. There is currently a protocol in the works called Newton, which will run directly on Wayland. ↺

ah that is what i was thinking probably

i remember Newton

Is it a Wayland protocol? I thought it was dbus as well.

it is based on dbus indeed. https://blogs.gnome.org/a11y/2024/06/18/update-on-newton-the-wayland-native-accessibility-project/ but also has a wayland protocol too

Ah right, that protocol is here to request updates mostly: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mwcampbell/wayland-protocols/-/commit/dbe3e10917b8060f1493fba7b6aae486eaeed635

> yes, im not arguing its useless, it just mostly hits the nerds, and they can endure a bit of pain :D That's not the only population that would benefit from this feature really (ATM) ↺